The Practice of Therapy

426 The Practice of Therapy Podcast
Speaker: Hello everyone and welcome to the podcast. This is episode number 4 26 of the Practice of Therapy podcast. I'm Gordon Brewer and so glad you've joined us for this particular episode. And in this episode we're gonna take a little bit of a divergence here. One of the things that, uh, we kinda ran into as we were, you know, scheduling things for our podcast, we realized we had a week in which we didn't have anyone scheduled to interview.
Now we've got a lot of other people coming up, but this particular week we didn't have anybody in specifically scheduled. So one of the things that I was talking with my assistant Rachel about is. What were some topics that she's run across that people were interested in hearing from me about? And so we thought, well, let's pose the question.
And uh, we put out on social media just, uh, ask Gordon anything or ask questions of Gordon. And we got so many responses from that. And so in this particular episode, we're gonna jump into. Talking about AI and also the advent of tech companies really kind of coming into the therapy space. In particular things like Better Help or Alma, those kinds of companies that we hear more and more about.
And so I'm gonna weigh in on what are some of the things I've been thinking about that. And um, also just let you hear from. Some of the listeners as far as not actually recordings of them, but let you hear from them and their questions. So I'm looking forward to you hearing more from this particular episode.
One of the things I'd like to invite you to do is, um, and this is kind of related to this per this particular episode, is we're noticing that more and more people are turning to YouTube. For podcast content. Now, we don't really, at least for me, don't normally think of, uh, YouTube as a place where you would necessarily listen to a podcast, but a lot of people are going to YouTube to watch it because they like this video format and.
This introduction is Nvidia, which I've not really done much of in the past, but probably we'll be changing that up. But I'd invite you to go over to our YouTube channel and it is under the Site Craft Network. And uh, you'll find a link here in the show notes and the show's summary to get to that. And I just simply invite you to subscribe to the channel and that way we can reach more people and also.
That helps us kind of monetize this, this particular podcast, all the content that we produce here. And just simply by you subscribing to, to the YouTube channel, the, uh, URL.
For our YouTube channel is simply youtube.com/at site craft network and you can find us there. And again, I invite you to sub subscribe to the network. Another thing too, um, before we get over to my thoughts on AI and also the tech companies in our mental health space I'd love for you to. Maybe check out working with me.
One of the things that I've been focusing on here the last several months is really working with people on an individual basis, because I get a lot of requests for that. And one of the ways that you can do it well, the way that you do that is just simply go to the website, just practice of therapy.com, and if you'll click on the link there at the top of the page to uh, where it just says coaching and consulting.
You can find out more about that and really how we start the process is just for you to book with me a free 15 minute brainstorming session where we can talk about your goals and the things that you want to be, want, help with. And, uh, really figure out if I'll be a good fit for you with that or not.
So be sure and check it out. Just practice a therapy.com and click on that link at the top of the page that says coaching and consulting. And also before we get to our, my thoughts on AI and the advent of tech companies, I'd love for you to hear from the sponsor of our podcast Therapy Notes, along with another sponsor of our podcast, the CCFO Financial Freedom Podcast.
As we started thinking about this particular episode, one of the things that, uh, we did is pose que or asked people to send us their questions. We didn't really pose questions to people, but ask people to send their questions to us. And and for this particular episode, I'm gonna focus on. The questions that people had around ai and also the advent of, uh, tech companies really moving into the mental health space.
Um, here was some of the questions that people asked is, um, how can therapists stand out in this day of ai? When people can go straight to a chat bot and talk about their problems. And then another question that was posed is, how do you see AI reshaping mental health, uh, mental health practice, and what, and at what point do we need to start asking harder questions about what we're willing to give up?
Then another question which I thought was interesting, particularly related to big tech, is how do we navigate these big tech companies that are exploiting therapists under the guise of helping them? And how does the public understand that companies like better help and some of the others, or bad news?
And then finally a question, which I think is a really good one. What impact, good, bad, or neutral has the increase in mental health information on social media had on people and their expectations of therapy? As you can hear, some really great questions and, um, not really sure where to start here, but one of the things that I think is important to think about is just thinking about how history, how we have responded to new technology over history.
When you think about it and you really go back in history, and I did a little research on this anytime any major. Technology has come up. Usually there is pushback from people initially going all the way back to the days of when the railroads were started you know, in, in, uh, back in the, in the early 18 hundreds and the invention of the modern train came into being in steam engines and that sort of thing.
People were afraid of the effect of moving at that speed would have on a person's body. So I mean, those are the ways that people tend to think about things. And so they were worried about that and the impact of the noise that they created and just would it be a good thing or not. And then the automobile was another one that came about and people just worried about, again, the speed at which people might travel. They were worried about it. You know, the effect on horses, on, on farms, and just all of that. And, um, look at where we are today with both of those, that two modes of transportation that in their day where there was a lot of pushback on, and I think about more recently i'm old enough to remember when cell phones came into being and there were, you know, there were worries about cell towers and the effect that those, those, uh, uh, having that much that many radio waves in the air were gonna affect our human bodies. And then also just thinking about. You know, how practical did we see it being?
I can remember, even for me thinking about when cell phones came into being, I would, I thought, well, why would I want that? Why would I need that? And then now, you know, look at me with my. With my iPhone, and I, absolutely depend on it every single day for communicating with people, for getting information, for all of those kinds of things.
And so I think anytime there is new technology that comes out. We are a little bit naturally weary because it's something new to us and there's also a big learning curve that occurs with that. And I don't care what gen generation you're from, we get we think about it that way. If it's something we're not, not used to or not really fully up to speed on.
Um. I was listening to a podcast this past week, and it's one that I like a lot. It's called The Hidden Brain Podcast, and it really delves into brain science and psychology and how we tend to think about things and really kind of deals with this whole topic of. Cutting edge kind of technology and things, uh, that we you know, in medical science and that sort of thing.
But one of the, the topic for this last episode, and I'm paraphrasing the title here, and we'll try to get a link in the show notes to that particular episode of that podcast, but they were talking about how we think about depression and rethinking depression and, um. One of the, the person that they interviewed was a psychologist and he started out as a grad student and working towards his PhD in history.
And he, um, he struggled with, during that period of time, he struggled with just a deep depression where he just lost all motivation. He just really was having suicidal thoughts. All of those things that we classically think of as depression. And one of the things that it, it did for him was he started thinking about going into a different career as a psychologist and becoming a psychologist to really start his studying that that particular problem.
And one of the things that he posed, or one of the things that was brought out in that particular episode is, again, if you go back in history and think about. Something a phenomenon that we've all experienced and that is getting a fever. It used to be that medical science back in the day, back in the 18, 17, 18 hundreds before we got into really kind of an era of modern medicine, thought of fever as being a disease itself.
Now we think about it much differently. We recognize that a, a fever is a symptom of something else, and usually it indicates an infection and that a fever is actually there to protect us rather than it, it itself being an attack on the body or it being something that we needed to. Eradicate every single time and going after the fever.
So they would give people these, the ice baths, they would use mercury compounds, they would bloodletting and all of those kinds of things, uh, which now we think of as, as ridiculous. But they thought about a fever as being a disease itself, as opposed to it being a symptom of a disease. And so. What that brings up for me is just thinking about problems that we're faced with, and particularly thinking about ai.
And maybe we're not thinking about the problem in the right way. And I think a lot of that goes back to just maybe at our, our limited knowledge about what it is, about what it can do for us, and understanding how that we can pivot to use it to our advantage. Uh, as opposed to seeing it as, uh, this enemy that's gonna attack us.
One of the things that I know, I know I started thinking about was what is, what are things like better help coming onto the scene or technology companies, uh, that are offering, offering platforms for us to provide telehealth to our clients in different, different ways. But also AI being a a technology that we're worried about it replacing us as therapists.
I think maybe we've been, maybe one thing it caused a question is, is maybe the way we're doing things, the way we're provi providing our services or maybe even a question of what are we doing that's really helping people in the mental health field now, certainly when I was coming along in graduate school and that sort of thing.
I think about what we do now much differently than I did back then. I remember in grad school hearing about EMDR for the first time. Again, I'm aging myself. And just thinking about those things and I thought that just sounds crazy. Why in the world would anybody go and do. Movement stuff to help with something like technology.
And we really didn't know as much back then, and we're just talking about a short period of time, really in the grand scheme of things. Just a, you know, I, I first went into graduate school a little over 20 years ago, and so again, I'm aging myself, but that was. That was cutting edge stuff. But now we think about it as being something that is a validated kind of a form of therapy that has a big impact on people that we thought was just, oh, this is hocus pocus kind of things.
And so. One of the things I think we need to think about with things like better help is that that is a form of therapy, a form of delivering therapy that I think the public is asking for or looking for. Now granted, I totally agree with maybe the problems of. How does that interfere with confidentiality of people?
How does that promoting kinda lower rates that we get paid as therapists. Um, all of those kinds of things are even offering I know better help touts their service as providing an affordable way to get access to mental healthcare. Again, looking at the other side of the coin for us as therapists.
That's what people are looking for, is they're looking for ways to receive therapy in an affordable way. Now that doesn't mean, you know, and you've heard from me a lot of times on the podcast, I'm, I might sound like I'm. Uh, speaking out of both sides of my mouth, I think you need to get paid what you're worth and I think you need to be paid well for what you do.
And so really looking at, okay, how can you leverage something like a technology company into something to build a practice and that sort of thing, and create a viable a viable practice for yourself. Here's a way to think about maybe with tech companies. I think that's a good starting place for a lot of people that are starting out in a solo practice.
I think it's a good. A good way to start building a client base for yourself and creating some income for yourself, particularly if you're just starting, starting out now. I think in the long run, it's probably, if you're going to go into private practice full-time, to stay on that platform, uh, is not gonna be as lucrative as going out on your own and really doing, um.
You know, getting paid directly rather through a platform like that. So I think part of it is, is that it requires you to think about what it is you need for yourself differently. No one is, um, forcing you to go onto those platforms. And I think that's something we have to acknowledge. But I've known a lot of therapists that are working for, um.
Agencies and that sort of thing, and then have used the platforms like that. Those tech company platforms, Talkspace better help Alma those, those kinds of platforms as a way to get their toe in the door with building a private practice for themselves because you can, if you're working for an agency. You can maybe, unless there's something written into your contract around not seeing people within your area, which again, that's a way for you to expand out to a, a geographic area where in which you're licensed a state or a province or whatever where you're licensed, to be able to see people as a side hustle to be able to start building a private practice from that standpoint.
Long term, probably not a good idea to stay on one of those platforms. But it's a good way to kinda get your, your feet wet and your toe in the door with building a private practice. Because not to get too far off on a, on a tangent here, but one strategy that I would recommend for people if they're wanting to go into private practice and maybe they're working for an agency.
Is to start out or one of those platforms. No, you're not gonna get paid a full rate that you could get if you are on in practice for yourself and not on one of those platforms. But you could start seeing people on that platform then taking that money. And putting it into a nest egg or to build a reserve for yourself so that when you do go into private practice, you've got the money there to support yourself.
Uh, that's tucked away, that's protected in order to build your practice while you're building your caseload and in a private practice. So that, that would be one thought about that. I think another thing to get back to things like ai, AI is simply a tool and I think in the long run, I think what is gonna happen is, is that.
People will go to AI to solve a problem, but I think we all know it's not gonna replace human to human contact. I think that's something that we all need, something we'll crave. And so coming the, one of the, the number one factor for the effectiveness of therapy and the research backs this up, is that patient therapist relationship.
And I don't know, you might be able to veil build an artificial relationship with ai, but I think in the long run people are going to find that it's not gonna be fulfilling and I think it will be short-lived for them and that they will recognize that they need that human contact. And yet, in order to, um.
In order to really be, get to the needs that they need help with or get to the, the solution or get to, the kind of relationship that they need which can only be done through therapy. So in that sense, I don't think we're, we need to sound the alarm bells too quickly with that because that's, again, just from my own life's experience.
But also just knowing what people need is gonna be something that they're gonna figure out about. And I think one of the questions that was asked was, you know, how do you compete with that? You compete with that by putting out there that human contact, that human element that you can't get from ai.
At least not at this point, whether it will get to that. I don't know. There's, uh, you know, I think about. All the sci-fi movies that kind of tout AI characters as, uh, as being a replacement for human characters. But anyway, I think that is something that we have to really kind of, uh. Maybe put that fear aside and really look at, at the value of human contact.
And that's what we need to market is that human contact and that way of connecting with us as a therapist. You know, the number one, uh, method or the best method for. I wouldn't say number one, but the best method for advertising and marketing your P practice is to be able to convey to people that you understand the problems that you're having, that they're having and how you can help them in a transformation into a place where that problem is no longer a problem for them or they are overcoming.
The mental health struggles that they're having. Yeah, so I'll put that out there for you and just thinking about things in that way. Let's see. The other thing that, I think one of the questions that I think that all of this brings up for us is, um, how accessible are we making ourselves to our clients and how is what we are doing truly helping them?
We have a notion in our head and we have an idea in our head, particularly after having gone to graduate school and really. Looking at academia and what is, what we are taught in graduate school when, and you come outta graduate school with all this knowledge or all this understanding about different methods of therapy, of being able to look at people's internal worlds and being able to come up with a way to conceptualize what's going on for people.
All of those things are tools that we need to kind of, is kind of the baseline. Having done this as long as I've done it, a lot of what we learn in school might not necessarily work as well in the real world as we might have been taught. In particular. Yeah. Here's a, here's a small example of that.
You know, we're probably taught in graduate school to kind of be a blank slate for people in the therapy room. In other words being able to, to show empathy, to show, that we understand that we are somehow another building rapport without really letting them into our internal world at all.
And I've changed my mind about that a lot. One of the things that I've learned over the years. Is that a bit of self-disclosure with a client about our own struggles, builds a lot of clout with clients, and then we become somebody that they can trust, somebody that they're going to, uh, allow themselves to become vulnerable with, uh, much more quickly if they understand.
Okay. I'm sharing with you some of the struggles that I've gone through in my life. That doesn't mean I have to tell 'em my whole life story or get into real, real deep with people. But when they know that that goes a long way in helping them understand. The therapeutic relationship, I think. And so, um, again, that goes against conventional wisdom of what we're taught in graduate school or maybe even taught or even, uh, brought out in our codes of ethics and that kind of thing.
I don't want to go too far off on a tangent here, but I think it's okay for us to kind of maybe give some pushback to what we were taught and I know there might be some people that would wholeheartedly disagree with me on that, but that's what I've learned in the years that I've been doing what I've been doing as a therapist.
So again, I think it's important to really think about these problems of. Tech companies coming into the space, they're not going away. There are millions of dollars put into those things. Better Help is owned by a company called Teladoc, which is a publicly traded company. So on the front end, we know that they are there to make money, but at the same time, not to totally demonize those tech companies. I've, I have some problems with the way that they do things. I think that they are maybe listening into our conversations with clients, uh, too much, but at the same time need to look at. Those are the kinds of services that people are seeking that they want.
I think maybe they've been advertised in a way that we do have to question, but I think it's important for us to look at both sides of the coin with all of this and not approach it with fear, but with a lot of curiosity. And, um, I would say if you're. Dead set against those kinds of things, just don't participate in it.
I think that's, um, I don't know that for me necessarily I believe in advocacy and I believe that we need to speak up about things, but I don't think it's something we have to approach with a lot of fear. And again, that's my opinion with a lot of these things. So the other, um, the other thing that I would want to bring up for us.
Is the question I pose and it say, it seems like almost every episode is getting back to your why. Thinking about why you are doing what you're doing in this, in this particular profession, uh, or just any career is as far as that goes. You know, what is it that is your ultimate goal or your ultimate why around doing what you're doing?
I believe that we should be paid what we're worth and we're worth probably a lot more than what we get paid most of the time. I think that there is value in mental health services. It's why I, I do what I do. I'm a helper. I want to help people. I love seeing people grow and have those aha moments in session and being able to, um, make progress in the struggles that they're having in their life.
And also I like to be able to make a living. I love the fact that in private practice it gives me a lot of freedom. It gives me in, at least in the way that I've got my practice set up a better way for me to increase my income or have better earning potential, particularly in the geographic area that I'm in by being in private practice.
It gives me an opportunity to provide a place for other therapists to work in that I have a group, group practice and giving them a lot of the opportunities that I've created for myself with the autonomy, with their schedule, uh, with being able to. Uh, decide on the size of their caseload as opposed to being in an agency where you're, where the number of clients that you see is kind of forced on you.
And also being able to have some autonomy on the, uh, around the types of clients that they see. So those are some of the why's that I have around why I'm in private practice. And also being able to look at. What is realistic as far as the income I want to produce for myself? I could certainly probably learn the skill of going out and being a investment banker or going out and learning how to do something in the stock market or something, or a real estate investor or all those kinds of things.
Those are things that are of interest to me, and I could make a whole lot more money doing those things. But when it comes down to it, my values and the lifestyle that I've created for myself and also the stage of life that I'm in has a lot to do with why I'm doing what I'm doing. So again, going back to that question of thinking about, you know, going, you know, full circle from thinking about.
Is AI a threat to our, our profession? Is AI a threat to what we do? I would say look at that with a lot of curiosity and learn how you can use it and leverage it to help you in your practice and what you want to do. But also looking at thinking about the the platforms, the the tech company platforms is maybe being a stepping stone to something else, as opposed to seeing it as a threat. So hopefully this information is, is helpful for you. And just thinking about these questions that were posed, I think it's, um, a lot of times we have to really kinda look at what we're, why we're asking what we're asking.
And I think if we're, a lot of times if we're brutally honest with ourselves, we are, we're fearful because it's just stuff that we don't know about. Real quickly before I go, one of the things again. An advantage to ai, and again, I'm cutting off on a little tangent here, not a really good close here.
But, AI can be really helpful with scheduling and being able to, um, help you in a lot of the in administrative functions of running a practice. I've got a lot of great friends out there that are really delving in deep to that one in particular, a shout out to my good friend Uriah Guilford at Over at Productive Therapist.
He's put together a platform that is absolutely brilliant that uses ai. As a, as an intake coordinator for your practice so you can check him out. Again, here you go, Uriah. I'm giving you some free advertisement for your platform, but again, that's where. I think about with my friend Uriah, he's approached all of this with curiosity and thinking, okay, how can I leverage this to help what we do in our practices day in and day out?
So I think that's, that's a good attitude to have and really, again, thinking about your why behind why we do what we do, uh, in our practice and what are your values around that, and go with what fits for you.
Folks, I hope this has been a helpful e episode for you. I'm so glad you're part of, uh, this journey with me. I, um, I'm always, uh, thrilled to get, uh, comments and, uh. Messages from people and emails just with your questions and just really looking at how I can be of help to you in this journey as a private practice owner or a a, a person that's in the mental health field, because like I said, I've been doing this for a long time and.
I've learned a lot the hard way and I don't think you need to do the same. So, um, do take time to follow us and subscribe to the podcast, and particularly on YouTube. I'd invite you to go over to youtube.com/at site craft network, and I'm really toying with the idea. Uh, branching out into some other areas on that network with just some YouTube com content that's really geared more towards some.
Men, men's mental health in particular, and just thinking about, what it is that men struggle with that's different, uh, than maybe women. I think one of the things, uh, that I've learned over the years is that I'm in the minority here as a male therapist. There are many more female therapists than male therapists.
And so I think, um. I can add a little different, um, perspective to all of this, particularly for men. So, anyway, just toying with that idea. I'd love to get your comments and thoughts on that. Also just being a single person, a widowed person, and what that's like in the world of dating and all those kinds of things that, uh, I never thought I'd be delving into that hole.
Area of thinking about what we do in. Mental health and that sort of thing. So anyway, that's a little teaser of what I might be doing here with the Site Craft Network channel here in the near future. But do, do, subscribe to it. And also big thanks to our sponsors of the podcast Therapy Notes. They're who I use in my practice.
Absolutely couldn't work without them. They're, uh, again, you talk about technology and AI and that sort of thing. They are, um, have been on the cutting edge of putting tools in place that makes the administrative and clinical functions of our practice run so much more smoothly, particularly with their therapy fuel function, which is an AI generated, um.
It helps you write your therapy notes and your notes and your progress notes and it's, uh, pretty amazing stuff really. Uh, so be sure and check it out. If you'll go to practice of therapy.com/therapy notes and then use that promo code is Gordon, G-O-R-D-O-N. You can try it out for two months for free. And then, um, the other thing is also I'd love for you to check out the CEO Financial Clarity Podcast, and if you want more financial clarity in your business, make sure you subscribe to the CEO Financial Clarity Corner podcast. It's really packed with a lot of practical insights on managing your money increasing profit. And paying yourself, whatever, what you feel like you deserve.
And there are links here in the show notes. And trust me, your future self will. Thank you for listening to that particular podcast. And again, thanks to them for being a sponsor of this podcast. So take care folks. Got a lot of other great episodes coming up and gonna do some more. Episodes like this, and I'd love to get your feedback on that.
Do take time to subscribe to us on YouTube. Take care folks.