The Practice of Therapy

Gordon: Well, hello everyone and welcome again to the podcast and I'm really excited for you to get to meet Aaron Mallory and Aaron and I have just, as I do with everyone on, on the podcast, we've just been chatting a little bit here ahead of time and I can already tell you're going to get some really good vibes with Aaron and I'm, I'm really excited for him to be a guest.
So welcome Aaron to the podcast.
Aaron Mallory: Thanks for having me.
Gordon: Yes. So Aaron, as I start with everyone, why don't you tell folks a little bit more about yourself and your story and your journey and how you've landed where you've landed.
Aaron Mallory: Yeah, yeah, so I guess I could kind of start off where undergrad, honestly you know, so I got my bachelor's degree in electrical engineering and during my senior year, you know maybe like my junior year, I started, like, mentoring kids.
And I started also, like, working with incoming students in the college of engineering and particularly minority students, and we just started helping them, like, kind of understand how to do calculus. You know, a lot of students kind of will fall off because of the challenges with math and, you know, I started seeing the success of my students by just mentoring them and guiding them.
And then I started working with, like, a trio up around programs, mentoring kids. And man, I have some pretty cool internships, but, like, when I graduated, I recognized that, you know, Engineering was more of a job and not my passion, you know, and I really wanted to go home and mentor kids and, you know, from Chicago, want to go back into inner city of Chicago and really like, encourage kids to go to college at that time and do workshops.
And so I remember moving back home and move back home with my mom and my mom had this look. On my face of, like, her face, like, you got an engineering degree, you're moving in with me. You want to mentor kids? Like, you know, she's just frustrated. I think, you know, because, like, you know, she helped me get through college and all that, but, you know, like, mom, I really, you know, I just want to make a difference.
And so, you know I started going to these different schools, doing workshops and presentations. And 1 day this lady,
Gordon: it was like, at 1
Aaron Mallory: of the schools I was doing work, she said, you should go to school for social work. And I said social work? She said yeah, I didn't know much about social work, except, you know, people always say social workers don't make money like that's that's that was like the preface of a lot of it, but I didn't know, but I started like researching what social really was and started, you know, looking at started seeing like a lot of organizations that, you know, had eds at the MSW behind their name.
And so I said, okay, so I went and got my master's went to University of Chicago and I learned a lot of good information while I was there. And 1 of the, we did a case study was on a community mental health center. That was on far South side of Chicago that was open to really provide, mental services for the African American community at a time when those services didn't exist and we learned we did a case study on how to use.
Medicaid and things like that. And so I was intrigued like, hey, this could be something. And so when I graduated I worked at that agency was a community mental health center learned a lot, but, you know, to those that worked at community mental health center, they don't pay much and they work really hard.
And so during that time, though, I learned a lot about how Medicaid works, how billing works, became a supervisor, learned different clinical intervention modalities. So really sharpen my toolbox. But, you know, I think one of the things that it did for me. Was that I would, I would have a caseload of clients and I was the only African American male on my team.
So I would have a caseload full of African American boys and I would go into these houses and I would be like, the only positive going to house oftentimes father's one in the household. I'll go to the school. Not a lot of male figures in the school system. Just so moms will reach out to me and say, hey, he worked with my other son.
I got a nephew that, you know, I just think if you could work with him, just, you know, just having that connection and being able to build that, you know, That a therapeutic report, and so the idea hit me, like, hey, I should build a business of practice around providing practitioners that are of color, particularly African American males for African American boys who, you know, it was just it was just a need for.
And so the idea started kind of ruminating in my mind, started thinking about a lot, started kind of doing the initial paper, and I knew that I really wanted to work with the Medicaid population and oftentimes, you know, my colleagues. from the Medicaid population, right? Like, you know, you go to private practice, you want to get PPO insurance, the blue crosses.
And, and I knew like the population, like I feel I was called to work with, they don't have PPO, they have Medicaid. So I knew I had to figure out kind of how that works so I could serve that group. And so I left that job and I went to another job and kind of did more of like a, A clinical director over, like, gun violence work looking at how do we use clinical interventions to address gun violence within the city of Chicago.
Great experience learn. I mean, I became an expert at CBT. It was awesome. But I remember on March 13, 2020, I said, you know what? I'm a, I'm a leader's job and I'm gonna do my, my, my practice full time. Now, I don't know if you remember what was going on on March 13, 2020, but like, this was like at the height of the pandemic, right?
So I'm in Illinois and I remember like that, that Monday, so they canceled my going away party and we had to do it virtually because of COVID. And then that Monday, I remember our governor, J. B. Pritzker, shut down the state. And so, I'm like, I just quit my job, and I don't know, like, what's going on, like, I'm like, Aaron, I just quit my job to do something and I don't even know what's going on with the world right now.
And so I remember sitting at home with my daughter, like, it was kind of salty for about a week, but, you know, like, you know, I'm a very big faith person. I really felt God was calling me to do this. And so, I had a small little office. Went into my office and you know, parents started calling like, hey, you know, my son needs to talk to somebody.
We'll put a mask on and come like, he needs to see somebody like, literally, it just started to grow. I started, you know, I knew 2 other colleagues that were, you know, social work workers in the mental health field, you know, reached out to them, you know, as they were interested, they were like, yes. And from there, I mean, during the pandemic, we grew.
It was like 3 of us, 10 of us. I mean, today, like, I have a staff of over 100, you know. And we're in Chicago. We're in Peoria, Illinois. We're in Carbondale, Illinois. We're in Rockford. Was opened up in Cincinnati. Getting ready to open up in Detroit. So we've grown like significantly. And again, we cater to the Medicaid population and I really like kind of reach define what does it mean to be particularly community mental health agency, but like an agency that is focused specifically on, you know, building Medicaid.
And really also think about how we provide quality services to a population that deserves it. Right. Yeah. For me, it's, you know, that's. That's the story, particularly around, you know, kind of how I got the practice going, bumps and bruises along the way, but that's the initial story of it.
Gordon: Well, I'm just, I'm just amazed.
You know, particularly for someone to start, you know, at the beginning of the pandemic, number one, I mean, just all those kind of obstacles and, and, and things, and, and the fact that you've grown to the size that you have and really a relatively short period of time again, I'd, I'd love to pick your brain with how you were able to do that and so, so quickly.
And you know, I guess the other, i, I guess one question that comes to mind for me, Aaron, is, is that it sounds like at some point you made a decision, do I want to do maybe for profit versus nonprofit? Did or did that even come into consideration along the way?
Aaron Mallory: Yeah, you know, so the idea around a nonprofit was more because of wraparound services.
Like, the goal was to be able to provide wraparound services as well at a point. And we do now and so to be able to attract grants, you know, so we've been able to get grants. So we have a clinical workforce program for our reentry population. So guys that come home, we do half a day of intensive cognitive behavioral therapy.
The other half, they work in our screen print facility where they're making T shirts, but just learning how to work in a work environment in a group setting. And so we're able to get grants to be able to pay. For those guys to get paid for, you know, while they're working in the screen printing, and then when they get in the clinical, we build a Medicaid for, we also have housing programs that we provide for our reentry population.
You know, we do different incentives for, you know, we work with a lot of young people that are on probation for gun cases, things in Chicago. And so, you know, we have different incentives. So the grants being a nonprofit allows us to get different grants to get a support. Gotcha. But the, the, the Medicaid and, and because we, we generate a surplus also allows us to be able to have a, a substantial amount of unrestricted dollars to be able to invest in what we do.
Right? Mm-Hmm. , but I also am getting creative and so like our, our Ohio is credentialed as a, as a LLC. And so that, that's a, that is a for-profit component. And so, okay. I've been bringing on entertaining different attorneys to think about how we can, like, really think about how we structure in a unique way.
So they're both armed where we have a for profit and nonprofit, but initially kicking off. I knew I wanted to have wraparound services and so because of that, you know, it was just advantageous to do as a nonprofit so that you could attract grants to get an offset. And I think 1 unique thing about us too, is that though.
We're not dependent on grants because of the way we build on Medicaid and things like that. But the grants are a good supplement to be able to provide additional services. I think, you know, as we address mental health and we help somebody get at a baseline. But if, you know, you don't have the tools to be able to obtain employment, or you don't have housing.
Mental health is going to continue to struggle, right? And so for us, it's like, hey, let's get people at baseline, but let's provide these wraparound to be able to help and support them as well.
Gordon: Right. Well, Jay, yeah, I just, I'm curious too. And when you initially started moving into this, did you ever think it would get to this size?
Aaron Mallory: Got a big ambitious goal. So yeah. And no, I didn't think it would be as quick. But the goal is to be national. It didn't go overly right? Like, I've always told people, like, I don't want to just be in Chicago, Illinois. I want to branch out to other states. I want to figure out how to do work in another country, whether that's Haiti, whether that's going to to Africa or countries in the Caribbean and figure out how to do this work.
So I do have a pretty massive vision, Lord willing, that I did. I'll be able to achieve. So mm hmm. But I, I, I do wake up like, you know, like, man, I can't believe this is what we're doing and, you know trying to always get better, but it's definitely a blessing. I'll tell you that. All
Gordon: right. Right. Wow.
It's, it's amazing just to hear this story. And I know one of the things that probably if I were to pick your brain a bunch, one of the things that I'm guessing is one of your super powers is the ability to delegate. And. And hand off to team members so that you're not doing it all yourself.
Aaron Mallory: Spot on.
And I feel like I've learned, you know when I don't, like I feel like God has revealed to me, like, when I don't delegate and I try to do things myself, it just does not succeed. And as soon as I delegated and handed off and And spend time training people like, oh, my goodness, like, it grows 10 fold.
Like, so I think delegation is so important and I had to learn it the hard way because, you know, when I first started, I was doing everything I was doing my billing. I was didn't have any, you know, see clients do my notes doing screening calls doing initial assessments. Doing the marketing on social media and it just was a headache and then, you know, I started just bringing on people and, you know, I also I invest like I invest in the business.
I'm big on like, you know, what? Maybe, you know, especially the beginning. I didn't pay myself a lot in the beginning. And if it may pay other people, but they may make more money in the beginning. It allows us to grow and build our infrastructure. And so for me, even to now, like, you know, we do well, but I invest significantly in updating our data management system, always looking at what's the best HR system that we should be using, how do we enhance our marketing capabilities to retarget or different things, right?
So I've always just had that. Like if I invest in people and, and attract good people around me, and if I got to pay them a little bit more. But I know that it's going to advance and we can do, you know, do more volume that we're going to generate more, we're going to help more people and then the bottom line organization is going to be better, right?
Gordon: Right.
Aaron Mallory: But I think that ideal of, you know, oftentimes, you know, that aspect of not trusting people or fear, like, you're the only one that can do it. You know, I dealt with those in the beginning. I had to, I had to get rid of it quick. Because even now, like, I wouldn't be at the level I'm at right now if I, if I didn't delegate, you know, and have a team of people.
Right. But I think also to be intentional about training people like. You know, we use training well that's what all of our policies and procedures we have all of our training videos. So when people get on board, they kind of have different quizzes and things they can learn, but just, you know, just taking time and and training people, creating systems where they can go back to and learn the policies and the systems expectations is so important.
But. It's, it's yielded so much fruit doing that, you know, significant. Yeah.
Gordon: So, I, I'm curious too you started out in engineering background, moved into social work. Somewhere in there, you've learned the business side of things. How did that come about?
Aaron Mallory: Yeah I, I would say for some of it is reading, you know.
Okay. But I think too, it's just like trial and error.
One of my favorite books is thinking, grow rich by Napoleon Hill, you know, and as I never say a book on specific business, but it's a book on just the manifestation of ideas. It believe, right?
Gordon: Mindset. Yeah.
Aaron Mallory: What you can attract around you. Right? And so and then from there, you know, listening to podcasts on different entrepreneurs, talk about how they do their business.
You know you know, Google, we live in so much information, you know, my dad, my dad was an entrepreneur, you know, so, like, I kind of saw some of those things growing up as well. And so yeah, you know, and I think 1 thing about engineering, it makes me I'm very analytical. So I'm big on step by step processes, data outcomes, like my brain is programmed in that way.
And so everything we do in the agency, that's how I think those are questions. And I think even as a clinician, like, and I kind of, you know, struggle sometimes because that's not the real, you know, as a clinician, we're more of a, you know, Processing and, you know, understanding and, you know guiding the client through that, you know, but what's best for them.
Right? And so, you know, my analytical mind would get in the way of those things. Sometimes I had to check myself on there, but on the business side, very intentional about kind of how we do things, what we do. Knowing what specific questions to ask and thinking about, you know, ultimately how we solve problems with this.
Right.
Gordon: Right. Well I, I know the other thing that you've done, Aaron, and because we talked about this a little bit before we started recording, you've kind of pivoted or pivoted, maybe that's not the right word, but you've, you started a virtual assistant company that and from what little bit you told me about it is actually getting folks from Nigeria.
That are kind of running it. So, so say more about all of that.
Aaron Mallory: Yeah. So my freedom, so I started off, you know you know, as I was growing my price, I knew I needed, needed help. Right. And as I was starting, you know, I had a office manager. But, you know, as we were growing, she needed more help, and I just couldn't afford it, you know, at the time to be able to hire somebody else, particularly in the States.
And so I was using a virtual assistant overseas. I think maybe in the Philippines and they were okay, but it just weren't getting done the way I needed to. And I figured that if, you know, maybe, you know, if I created my own, you know, a virtual assistant company that, you know, I could, you know, number 1, have the source train and also help other practitioners.
I had colleagues and friends, and I knew that were. You know, being stressed out, overwhelmed, and, you know, we will have these conversations. They will say, yeah, I'm doing everything, you know, and I really want to grow. I just don't have the time and I definitely don't have the money to do it. And so I traveled to Nigeria in 2022.
1 of my friends was going there for a funeral. And so, you know, he invited me to come with them. I went and I went to different universities across Nigeria, particularly social programs. And I landed at Babcock University, met with the social work director there, talked about my vision. Fell in line to in regards to kind of, you know, trying to create employment opportunities for, for the students that were graduating from there, you know, and I think to also, I was like, hey, I want to do something where I can build economic sustainability, particularly, you know, on the continent, Africa, Nigeria, where, you know, oftentimes jobs are limited resources are limited.
And I said, hey, this could be a good way to make a connection to where social workers in Africa could be helping practitioners here in America. We're now practitioners can grow their business. But at the same time, these social workers now have, you know. Employment they're doing well, they're thriving able to take care of their families.
And so from there, you know, I started using a virtual assistant myself start off 1, 2. I mean, right now we use about maybe 15 just for grow alone and they do all of our data management data tracking. They do our screenings. They do our billing. Our EOB is calling our insurance companies reconcile and claims.
I mean, when we got to analyze this. Data reports are going into all that back and support for us. Also, you know, like, we have created a system where, you know, 1 of the things I used to hit as a practitioner. Was that they want us to do so much, like, when I worked at community health, we had to do all these assessments.
Progress notes, documentation, and then you still had to meet a a productivity requirement. Right? And I used to hate it on top of that. They weren't paying you anything either, you know, so, like. It was like all these expectations. I used to hate it. And I said, like, when I open my practice, it's going to be different.
So, like, we create a very basic, simple system where, you know, our clinicians are doing click, click, click from their are transcribing notes, putting into the HR system. They go in and sign off on it, but it minimized times for practitioners significantly. Same thing with assessments. We created systems where our virtual assistants are coming in doing a base and stuff.
They get the info they need from the condition. And so it minimizes. The time that our clinicians have to do on paperwork so they can be intentional about being in the field and seeing their clients. Right. And so yeah, so it's, it's, it's been something my freedom va.com or gift freedom va.com is our website.
But yeah, it's, it's been something that, you know, we've, we've seen it grow and for me, like, it's, it's, it's too, like I said, it's too fun. I want to see practitioners grow their practice. Right. And, and particularly in an African American community where, you know, there's always been a stigma around mental health, but now, you know, people are starting to see, like, hey, there's, there's value to it, but the concern is that there's not enough practitioners to service, you know, particularly African American community, right.
2 percent of psychologists. Yes. Our African American, I mean, the shortages, particularly African American men just in the mental health field as a whole. And so my hope is that if I can help practitioners point in and build in their practice, they can recruit talent. And then more families can get the quality mental health services that they need.
You know, I mean, I just know so many people who Practitioner to say, yeah, I got a wait list because, you know, the demand is high. I just, you know, I don't, I don't have the time to build the infrastructure to build my practice so I could bring on more people and that disheartens me all the time, you know?
And so if my freedom can be that tool that that's, that's the goal.
Gordon: Yeah. Yeah. And I think one of the big take home points I would say with all of that Aaron is, is in order to grow or in order for anybody to scale, regardless of whether they're profit, nonprofit or whatever, you got to. It can't be done alone.
You've got to build a community of people and experts and people that you can delegate to it in order to that. And, and even as long as I've been in practice, I'm still have to remind myself of that because I tend to want to do it all on myself and it just gets you in the weeds really quickly. Oh, yeah.
Yeah. Tell folks how they can get in touch with you
Aaron Mallory: yeah. So our website is www. grocommunity. org and that's for the Organization Grow Community.
My freedom is get freedom va. com. You can find me on linkedin aaron. Mallory lcsw and yeah, I appreciate you for having me
Gordon: I hope to have you back here and just get more updates on everything.