The Practice of Therapy

Gordon Brewer: Hello everyone and welcome again to the podcast and I'm happy for you to get to know name Mike Zlokowski and Mike, sorry, with my pronunciation of your last name, but welcome. Yeah.
Mike Zoladkowski: Tricky last name. Yeah. .
Gordon Brewer: Yeah. So Mike is located in Calgary, Canada. And has been working with a lot of different therapists and helping them with their marketing.
And his his wife is also a therapist, and I'm going to let him kind of tell a little bit of his story of how he got started in this. So Mike, as I start with everyone, why don't you tell folks a little bit more about yourself and how you've landed where you've landed?
Mike Zoladkowski: So I've been doing marketing for over 12 years now, several years ago, my wife decided that she would like to move to a private practice. So we had to design everything. We had to build the whole business from scratch because at that point, I think it was 2021. She had no clients at all.
And in the end, we had to start somewhere, right? So what we did is what we designed the website for her. We designed the whole brand. And then we thought about, you know, the most effective marketing strategy that we can employ to get results as quickly as possible for her. We decided to go with Google ads and Google maps because, you know, it's kind of obvious when you're looking for new products, new services, Google is kind of the first place where you, where you go to, to find what you're looking for.
And yeah, as it turns out, it's the same story with mental health services. So the strategy we implemented, it worked. Monica's therapy grew like really rapidly. So at some point we thought why not use our, my marketing background and her therapy background to create an agency that works specifically with therapists, with coaches and you know, and help them do the same thing, help them grow their business, their private practice using the same marketing strategy.
that worked for us. So we are, this is what we've been doing for quite some time now. Yeah.
Gordon Brewer: Awesome. Awesome. Yeah. And so I, you know, I know that's a big thing, particularly for people getting started in private practices, you know, how do they get the word out? How do they reach their ideal clients? How do they start filling up their appointments?
And so you developed a strategy. So I'm just curious about if you can tell us a little bit about the strategy that you use and just with your clients.
Mike Zoladkowski: Right. So when we started, obviously we knew that she needed the website, right? Because this is like the starting point for whatever you do marketing wise, whether you decide to advertise on Google, on Facebook, wherever.
At some point you want to direct people to your website you at some point you want them to encourage you encourage them to book with you, right to become your clients your patients, whatever we refer them as. So, that was the first step in our strategy to design the website. that encourages people to reach out to book with Monica.
And yeah, so we, we took care of everything from, from the template that we designed that we used to create the website through copy. So all the texts and sections on the website to make it clear, to make it understandable to potential patients. We wanted, you know, for everyone who visits this website to get Like a gist of what Monica can help with how she can help with and why it's a good idea to book with her And at the end of of the website of each sub Subsection there was there is also because her business obviously is still running, right?
There is a booking calendar where everyone who's interested can book at first a free initial consultation that lasts around 15 minutes where they can You know ask all the questions dispel their doubts and monica can see whether a given person is a good fit So this was the first step and then we decided to start doing Google ads and Where there was a few reasons for that that for the one for one thing i'm doing marketing for other companies So I know that google ads is like a good tool to grow business, especially if you want those bookings quickly, right?
Some other strategies like for example seo may take some more time with google ads. It's it's faster. It's quicker. So So we decided to go with this way and several years ago I was kind of on the other side of the fence. I was the client and I I had an agency that was doing Google ads for a completely different business of mine.
And I was also very satisfied with the results that we got with this strategy. So we decided to, yeah, let's, let's give Google ads a try again and see how it works. And yeah. And the results that we got were quite. quite good, you know, she managed to grow her business to six figures in less than two years, starting from zero from like zero patients and nothing.
So So yeah, so this worked really nicely for us. And at some point, we thought why not do the same thing for therapists for other therapists, right? Because if you're an expert at therapy at mental health services, doesn't mean that you're an expert at marketing your private practice, right? Many therapists struggle with that.
So this is where we thought that we might be helpful for people, you know,
Gordon Brewer: sure, sure. Yeah. So in in just people that might be getting started or you know, obviously, I, I think it goes without saying, you know, and, and, you know, Here in 2024, you've got to have a website. Now, I know there are some therapists that just rely on things like psychology today and different directories and that sort of thing.
And, and for some people that works well, but I think if you're depending on your location, I totally agree. You're, Your website is your front door is, is what people come to first. And in your work with people, what are you finding that people struggle with the most in getting their websites? Correct.
Mike Zoladkowski: Yeah, you know, it depends on the person. Sometimes we see some issues with the mobile friendliness of the website. That was the case with one of our prospective clients that we talked to. We took a look at their website and the mobile version was not Adjust to to those mobile screens at all. Right? And right now this is a very important ranking factor for Google If your website is not mobile friendly, you will struggle to, you know, attain good positioning on Google Because what Google does is actually right now they are checking your mobile version Of your website first and not the desktop one.
So this is something that has absolutely been perfected. When it comes to other things I frequently see websites that are too short. Just, you know, very to the point. Very specific and on one on the one hand, that's good. But on the other hand, you also want to build trust, right? We always tell our clients that your website is your first sales person It's like your first line of sales and it needs to convey your message But it also needs to needs to you know, build trust towards you so that people can feel good They can feel understood With your messaging with your communication, because this is what triggers them to reach out to you if they feel like you're the person who can help them, right?
They will reach out because they you will gain their initial trust. Of course, then later on in the process, you need to maintain this trust. You need to prove them that you're the right person for the job, right? But your website does, does this first part of work. So it's, it's really important. And yeah.
And frequently we also see something that we kind of refer to sometimes as outdated design from the UX perspective. It's, it's like a personal preference thing, right? So it's not good or bad strictly in those kinds of terms, but sometimes we see design that comes from like maybe 10, 15 years ago. And for many people, especially younger people, this kind of design can be discouraging.
So we also recommend improving the design of the website to make it user friendly. So that everyone can find, you know, whatever they're looking for quickly without having to scroll through ten different sub pages or look for, you know, a specific button that allows them to book. So yeah, this is the other thing.
And and yeah, and still many therapists, they don't have any sort of booking feature on their website. Sometimes there's also an email address, maybe a mobile phone, and you need to call them in, in order to book with them. And we recommend, you know, streamlining the process. We recommend creating some sort of a booking feature that allows anyone who wants to book to do it whenever they want, because even with Monica's therapy, we see bookings coming in at 3am in the morning, right?
So we want to streamline the process. We want people to go to your website. Find what they're looking for and book with you as quickly as and as conveniently as possible. So these are just some of the things that we work with.
Gordon Brewer: Yeah, that's a, that's a, you know, in doing consulting with people, that's one of the first things I do is look at their website.
And one of the things that I'm sure you've run into this, Mike, as well, there's no clear call to action or even knowing how to, to book with someone. And so it needs that, That you're, you're exactly right. That needs to be front and center and nobody, they shouldn't even have to scroll to be able to do that.
In my, in my Way of thinking.
Mike Zoladkowski: Yeah. I agree. Yeah. Actually, CD buttons, they should be spread throughout the website in different places. So I don't need to go to the top or scroll down all the way to the footer to find this booking button. Right. It should be. Yeah. At all times. That's the goal. Right.
Gordon Brewer: Right.
Right. That's great. That's great. So in in thinking about your wife's practice in terms of how you are to help it to grow. What, what did you discover about what was, I know you, you mentioned having several different parts of a website that are important things that I think people, that people need to keep in mind.
What did you find that was most helpful in that, in that sense?
Mike Zoladkowski: Right. So I think it's important, you know, to include three parts or aspects of your offer on your therapist website. The first thing that you need to, you know, address is all the kinds of problems and issues that people may be struggling with, that you can help them overcome.
Because so that's one thing. The other thing is client groups. If, for example, you do couples therapy or teen therapy, right? These are two different therapy groups with different needs, different interests, right? So this also should be addressed on your website. And then lastly, we find it very helpful to include what kind of therapy approaches and modalities you use in your work and why these three approaches this, these three aspects of an offer primarily because of the way people look for help on Google in other places as well.
But we're specifically, specifically talking about Google here. So when we do keyword research for our clients, we see this three, three types of keywords of queries on Google. Some people look for. You know, teen therapy. They know that their teenager is struggling with something. They, they're not sure maybe with what exactly, but they feel like it's something's wrong, like something's off, and they need to find help.
So, like, intuitively, the first thing you do is, is look for teen therapy. Teen you know, teen treatment, teen help to see what are the options. So that's the first thing. The second thing is some clients are more aware about what they need. Sometimes they know, okay, I need EMDR, right? Because I know that this helps with trauma.
This is what I'm struggling with. I've read some about it. I know that EMDR might be a good thing for me. So I'm looking for EMDR, right? So your website, if, if that's something you do should also address this. And then lastly, we have issues, right? Some patients, some clients are less aware. There are some.
something that maybe, maybe I'm struggling with depression. Maybe I'm struggling with trauma. Maybe I have some sort of anxiety. And so this is what they be looking for. So your websites should accommodate different needs and different types of queries coming from your clients. This is very important.
Gordon Brewer: I love the way you put that because I think you're, you're exactly right.
When people are looking, you know, I love the way you, I don't know that I've heard anybody put it exactly how you did. There's both there's the demographics of the client. Which might be one query type there is the modality they're looking for a specific type of therapy. And then thirdly, the, the problem itself is that they're looking for help with.
And so being able to include those three things, I think that sounds, sounds brilliant. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, that's a, yeah. And I, you know, I know again, when I'm doing consulting with people and just thinking about, you know, what they put on their website is being able to write it in a way that helps the potential client see that you as the therapist get it.
You know, the words, you know, you know what it's like in their life and how they're that, that that comes across in your website.
Mike Zoladkowski: Yeah. And that you can help them with the same issue. Yeah.
Gordon Brewer: Right. Right. Well Mike, what are some other things that I know Google, the Google analytics and the Google algorithm is constantly changing.
What would be some consistent things that you've found that people need to include in their website that makes it more, I guess, quote unquote, Google friendly?
Mike Zoladkowski: Yeah. So thankfully when it comes to Google ads, we are a bit less prone to algorithm changes.
Gordon Brewer: Because this
Mike Zoladkowski: is where Google makes money, right? So they are more quote unquote forgiving when it comes to the websites.
We are more vulnerable to algorithm changes when it comes to SEO because here anything can change overnight. Of course, usually it doesn't, but there's always this risk. So if you're thinking about running Google ads, It's important, you know, to set several Google accounts within your website and then integrate them with the website.
So like you mentioned, it's, there's Google Analytics account that allows us to track traffic and track what's going on within your website when it comes to people visiting it, but also taking actions on your website. There is Google Tag Manager that basically tells Google what we want to track. within our website when it comes to actions that we want our patients or clients to take.
So this is called conversions. This term basically in therapy world, it basically means bookings, right? But it's a process. If you have a website to get a conversion, to get a booking, you have to follow a specific process or your client has to follow a process. At first they need to, of course, open the website.
Then they need to, you know, click the book now button. Then they will see either a calendar or a contact form, they need to fill it out and then send it your way, right? Or send the booking with an indicated date and hour. So we have three steps. And with Google Tag Manager, we can kind of tell Google what kind of those steps are, why do we want to track them, why they are important.
And then when we do, and we integrate Google Tag Manager with Google Ads, we can see that our, campaign, our ad campaign generated so many sent forms, so many clicks on book now button. So, so many calls to our business if we have a phone number on our website, right? So this is what we can track. And the more we track, The more data about our website and traffic that goes through it, we have the more effective yeah, the more effective Google campaign we can run.
So this is what matters. So at first you need to set everything, make sure conversions are measured. Sometimes, you know, sometimes measuring just one conversion, like for example, sent form or sent booking request. Can be enough. It depends on, on the website, but sometimes when you have several services, you have a bigger website, you may want to track different things.
So this, what we can, this is what we can do as well.
Gordon Brewer: Yeah. So it gives you, it gives you some clear data about what people are doing when they come to your website as well.
Mike Zoladkowski: Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Yes. Right. Then it gives us this information, but it also feeds Google algorithms because When we start getting data coming from website and send it to Google ads, like in a way, right, the Google starts to accumulate this information and they can start implementing some what sometimes is referred to as lookalike audiences.
So with Google knows that a specific person, of course, it doesn't track, any personal information. So from privacy perspective, we're good. There's no privacy or any, there's no information that's, that allows us to identify a specific person. Not at all. There's just technical information like in general location or type of device or day and hour of, of the booking, right?
So Google takes this information and uses it To display ads also to people who have kind of similar characteristics Which increases the probability of getting bookings from them as well because they match the criteria versus who already booked with us in the past So of course at first we don't have this kind of data when someone's just starting so at first we Everyone needs to be prepared, you know to wait for about one or two months to accumulate enough data coming from the website, coming from Google.
But then once we have that, we can optimize everything. The more conversions we get, the more traffic comes to our website, the more effective we can make those campaigns. Yeah.
Gordon Brewer: Right, right. So actually seeing what, what actually gets people to take action based on what kind of
Mike Zoladkowski: people, yeah,
Gordon Brewer: right, right.
Yeah. Yeah. And I think that's yeah, such helpful information for people in writing a Google ad, how do you, what's kind of your process for that and knowing what to put in the ad and what kind of verbiage to use and that sort of thing. Thank you.
Mike Zoladkowski: Yeah. So what we do is basically we, you know, we conduct strategy sessions with our clients so that they are fully aware of what's going on with their accounts.
And we also discuss the, the ads, their contents, what should be included in those ads to make them more effective. Here, you have to balance kind of two things. On the one hand, you need to balance, you need to include the suggestions from Google. They will tell you what kind of keywords or what kind of phrases are, you know, being searched on Google.
So you need to include them to make your ads more relevant, right? So, for example, if someone is looking for EMDR Calgary, right, as a As a query on Google, if the same kind of response or phrase shows up in your ad, it makes it more relevant, right? Because you see exactly what you've been looking for. This is what influences, like, the quality and effectiveness of the ad.
So, on the one hand, we need to include whatever's Google telling us, but then, of course, it has to be balanced out by, you know, making those ads Customer focused, client focused, and making those ads, you know, convey the message that we want to send, that we want to convey. Yeah. In our ads. So you cannot just focus on the keywords because this will make your web or your ads very technical, very robot like.
You need to include this personal human touch that makes it, that To your potential client. So, yeah, and and try to always balance these two elements to make those ads both Google friendly and user friendly. Yeah.
Gordon Brewer: Right. Right. Yeah. So the messaging just needs to make sure that it's on a level that isn't intimidating.
One hand, you don't want it to be intimidating, but more inviting because if you use a lot of technical terms and you know what we. We are notorious in our profession to start throwing out specific diagnoses and that sort of thing that we help with. And it's really just better to put it into,
Mike Zoladkowski: you
Gordon Brewer: know, simpler language.
Yeah. Yeah, that's good. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. So
Mike Zoladkowski: we always tell our clients that like your main goal is to make you sound knowledgeable. But also empathetic, also willing to help, also welcoming so that people don't feel intimidated, that they feel, okay, this person, I know they can help me, because on the other hand, I know they have qualifications, but I also feel comfortable with the way they talk to me.
So this is what matters.
Gordon Brewer: Yeah. How much you know, something that gets thrown around a lot just in entrepreneurship and also just in therapy world is the importance of niching or niching, however you want to say that word. What are, what are you finding around that as far as the, you, do you feel like it is important to niche with your practice?
Mike Zoladkowski: Yeah, it, yeah, it sure may be it depends on what kind of niche you have in mind, right? What we do is we always ask our clients what kind of therapy, what kind of target groups, and what kind of problems they feel comfortable with. And for everything that we got from them, we always run keyword research to see what kind of queries are popular.
in their area, right? So some niches are very good if they are popular on, on Google. So for example, if you do EMDR as a service and it's popular in your area, then definitely you should focus on that. Right. But there are sometimes if you, you know, if you, your niche is too narrow down, it may turn out you don't have enough searches on Google.
And in the worst case scenario, you won't even be able to run ads for this kind of niche. And basically it doesn't mean that it's a bad niche. It only means that you should focus on maybe some other ways of reaching that kind of clients. But with Google, if you want to advertise, you need to meet a specific threshold of searches.
If there's just, let's say five people looking for a specific service in a month, it does likely that Google will just display. This warning saying, not enough searches. Sorry. Come, come up with something else.
Gordon Brewer: Yeah. Yeah. That makes sense. What we, we didn't really talk about this ahead of time.
Mm-Hmm. , but one topic that is really hot right now is the use of AI . And what are you seeing with Google and Google Ads and being able to, I guess what. What's the potential for us in our field around therapists of using AI in terms of more helping with marketing,
Mike Zoladkowski: right? So when it comes to Google ads, Google has been using AI for quite, quite some time now, actually a specific AI related technology that's called machine learning, and they use machine learning algorithms to optimize all the ads that are run within Google ads.
Right. So even if you're not specifically using a I per se yourself, it's still being implemented in your campaign. Right at right now Google focuses with a I on organic results. So it's mostly for SEO, right? Right now, Google is working on an entirely new version of their search engine. When, where, you know, the first thing you see when you type in a specific query is an AI generated response based on several websites, several sources.
And that would usually rank high in the organic results. So this is still in the making they are just testing this in in several countries. So yeah If if you're not in the program, if not like a beta tester, you won't even be able to see this new, right? Search engine, but it will come eventually.
But for now, what we see and you know, talking with industry experts, this for now, the plans are too limited to a CEO, too limited to organic results. I personally think that Google will not temper that match with paid results, because this is where they directly make money, right? So they want to keep those clients happy.
Of course, there are other AI tools that you can use. For example, you know, if, if you're having trouble with wording, with conveying your kind of message, you can always use ChatGPT to help you with, you know, organizing your thoughts and, coming up with a nice headline or a nice ad. We usually, you know, work with our clients and we basically, most of the time we base on our experience to come up with ads that are, you know, tailored to the needs of, of the target audience.
But if this is something someone struggles with, there are many AI tools that can help you generate headlines, descriptions, or even ads themselves, not necessarily something we do. But yeah, it's an option, right?
Gordon Brewer: Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's it's, it's, it's, it's interesting in that I noticed this, I don't know how long they've been doing it, but on, on Facebook for example, they've got, when you do a search, it's connected to ai and so, yeah.
Oh
Mike Zoladkowski: yeah.
Gordon Brewer: Yeah. And so I'm sure that's, yeah, that's coming for Google as well, I'm sure.
Mike Zoladkowski: Yeah, probably. Yes. Yeah. In the near future.
Gordon Brewer: Yeah, yeah. So, well, Mike, I have to be respectful of your time. And I think this is just all good stuff for people to keep in mind and remember, and just thinking about their marketing strategies and you know, consider using Google ads.
I think and then To take it, make it easier using someone like you that knows how to do it rather than trying to spend a whole lot of time trying to figure it out, which I think is a good, obviously would be a good return on the investment, but tell folks how they can get in touch with you and if they want to work with you and how they could do that.
Mike Zoladkowski: Yeah, so everyone is invited to take a look at our website, fullybookedpros. com, where there's pretty much everything that we help with, from web design to Google Ads to Google Maps and optimization. And for practice of therapy podcast guests, we have our listeners, we have a special offer, 10 percent discount for the first year of cooperation on the management fee on our part.
So if you if you're interested if you want to grow your private practice not really want to spend a lot of time learning google ads because I've got to be honest, the dashboard is not really intuitive and at first it can be like really overwhelming. I sure know it was for me at first. So I know this can be difficult for many people.
If you want to, you know, just work with us and grow your private practice without investing too much time on your part, then yeah, you're happy to reach out. We offer free consultations. For anyone who's interested in growing their private practice, you can just book with us free consultation, pick a day, pick, pick a date, pick a time.
And yeah, we're, we're happy to chat with you.
Gordon Brewer: Awesome. Awesome. Well, Mike, this was a great conversation and I hope maybe we'll be able to be in touch again soon.